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AMABREEZE

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Give Obama all that's due and Bush none of the Credit .. But Why ? and the terrible state of rhetoric in American Politics

Sat May 14, 2011 5:57 PM EDT
politics
By amabreeze

Live Poll

Now that Barrack Obama has proven that he can be a strong leader. What are the chances of you voting for him for a second term ? Even if the economy doesn't pick up as much as you think it should have.

View Results
  • 149207
    Yes, for sure
    69%
  • 149208
    Most likely
    15%
  • 149209
    posibly
    4%
  • 149210
    Not likely
    12%
  • 149211
    make a decision when the time comes
    0%
  • 149212
    Other, please leave your choice in comments...
    0%

VoteTotal Votes: 26

Live Poll

What degree of Credit do you believe, the Bush Administration should get for the eliminating of Osama bin Laden ?

View Results
  • 149197
    All
    0%
  • 149198
    Most
    4%
  • 149199
    Some
    20%
  • 149200
    Very little
    28%
  • 149201
    None at all
    48%
  • 149202
    Other please leave your choice in comments...
    0%

VoteTotal Votes: 25

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In 2001, when the Military had identified the al Queda leader in Tora Bora and waiting for a go ahead. They couldn't get permission from the Republican administration to move to take him out. Was this one of the many misjudgments of the then members of this hawkish Executive team ? Or maybe, it was intentional ?

On msnbc"s the Last Word with Lawrence O"Donnell he ran a tape recently, that was from a March 13th 2002 with George W. Bush at a White House press conference. George in a grammar schoolish like defensive tone was saying in general that he wasn't thinking about Osama bin Laden, wasn't concerned were he was, that his effectiveness was marginalized and didn't care about getting him. Also that bin Laden was probably hiding in a cave somewhere, on the run. Not in a Command and control structure and didn't pose a real threat anymore. But now we know that Osama was in Command of his group and communicating through couriers.

Ironically, there was a man found in a cave and not in a position of command and control anymore. His name was Suddam Hussein...

In 2003, Intelligence was coming out that Iraq had possessed Weapons of Mass Destruction. Which now is commonly known as Not to be true. There must have been some waning support and sufficient opposition to hesitate to directly proceed to attack this Muslim country, at this point in time. Suddenly, splashed all over the news media, reports that Hussein had purchased yellow cake from Nigeria which is a necessary ingredient to successfully construct a Nuclear Bomb. This turn out to be a completely fabricated story by the Bush and co. pro war staffers.

Even though there was other intelligence that the Iraqi dictator had No know ties to Osama, al Queda or even the Taliban. Seemingly not giving serious consideration to this conflicting information. VP Cheney had cause to: ' scare the hell out the country '. By saying: this was a "slam dunk" that Saddam had WMD. And that Iraq was a Emanate Threat to neighboring countries and ultimately to the United States.

The GOP White House, now confident that they had produce enough justification and stimulated sufficient public support to start a war in a country, that didn't have any link at all, to the terrorists responsible for the 911 attacks in the USA.

It has been widely reported, that in 2005, that W. had directed the CIA to stop searching for Osama bin Laden. And this makes perfect sense. Because they had captured their SUBSTITUTE terrorist LEADER: Saddam Hussein. Also, Richard Cheney must have considered this a successful engagement when his former company Halliburton was receiving countless Billions of Dollars of taxpayers money to erect an oil infrastructure and performing many other very profitable services. With the public completely unaware, their actual goal was obtained and this must have been what they were reflecting to on the sign hanging behind Bush which read: MISSION ACCOMPLISHED ... Fortunately this 'Snow Job' is quickly melting as a continual stream of facts are coming to light..

Even with the approval of co/leaders Bush & Cheney, for the internationally illegal torture techniques, most notably Waterboarding. Whether it produced any vital intelligence, yet they had no intention of catching him and actually discontinued efforts to look for Osama bin Laden, then how on earth does the Bush administration deserve any recognition. The only chance they had of discovering the terrorist leader, was if our US security agencies inadvertently spotted him strolling around somewhere in Pakistan. But this would be virtually impossible because bin Laden was never known to leave his secured compound in Abbottabad. This is why the Credit their Administration truly deserve is ZERO...

With the Republicans occupying the White House and controlling all of Congress. They must have became to comfortable with their politically strong position. It seems that the GOP, who stress a strong work ethic had become considerably lazy. Having a false sense of being secure that their ' bill of goods 'would win over and Historians would eventually look more favorably on their controversial participation in the past events when a final draft was recorded.

There seems to be a clear contradiction from the self proclaimed Tough on Terror political group, who were dominated by semi-conservative affiliates at the time. With a Strong possibility of failure in a attempt to finding and/or eliminating the number 1 wanted man in the world. The politicians, who are many times refereed to as: The Party of NO. No legislation, No compromise etc. and now there should be added a new label, The party with No Guts...

 

     Unless, their attacking the working classes, the sick, the poor and  elderly's quality of life. Who's only real weapon of defense is a vote every so many years. Then the Republicans become brave soldiers fighting in another unjust battle.

President Obama, who in reality gave the order to go and get the most famous terrorist in the world which led to a successful conclusion. Then Soon after visited Ground Zero, the Navy Seals and attended similar related events. Which should have been considered a normal function of his job. But members of the FOX NEWS media outlets were complaining that Barrack was spiking the football. Accusing him of over celebrating and Grandstanding.

" Let's just say W. Bush had gotten bin Laden". Could you just imagine Glenn Beck,with his distorted interpretation of what the Bible is really trying to say. Announcing: Christian George Bush has destroyed the Islamic Beast, Osama bin Laden. Then predicting: This is absolute proof that the Tribulation time period which was written in the Book of Revelation, has started ...

Going back to 90's when Newt Gingrich was speaker of the House, wanted the evil federal government, to purchase Ronald Reagan's house in California with tax revenues. Funny thing was Reagan's home was on the top of a pedestal of land and you couldn't just drive up to it. You had to take a Helicopter. And as many of the believers in the policies of the past President, they considered him to be of a Godly status. After buying the residence, Newt wanted to make into a National Monument. This fatally flawed proposal never became law.

Knowing this, with the erupting fanfare of Religious Right. That Bush, one their own, has removed greatest terrorist the world. Truly he is the reincarnated savior of the Rich. This could serve as proof, to them, that it actually is the Wealthy who are the chosen people. Demanding that a statue be erected in George's likeness in Washington DC.  This could mark the beginning of the thousand year reign, under a iron rod, subject to the strict laws Republicanism.

Many will remember, If you weren't a supporter of the War in Iraq the conservatives were saying you were not a Patriot, some kind of traitor. That all Americans must support the sitting President in time of war.

Shortly before the Unbelievable Accomplishment of May 1st 2011. Barrack Obama released his long form birth certificate hoping to satisfy the growing number of doubters that he was actually born the United States. This is a requirement to legally hold the office of the President.

For the sake of argument, what if Mr. Obama wasn't born in Hawaii or any other state in the USA. Let's go deeper into the quality of this man. When President Obama first enter office he directed the CIA to make it their top priority to find Osama bin Laden. After a couple of years of intense investigation they were finally getting a lock on the terrorists' location.

On Saturday the day before the historic event the President was thumping Donald Trump, who had the highest media coverage of all the birther's With his normal cool, calm, intelligent demeanor, Obama was jokingly minimizing the importance of the decisions Donald had to make on his TV show. Barrack also said, he had more important things to think about. Little did anybody know what monumental event was in the back of his mind when he was saying this.

The next day, Sunday the President, with enormous courage, decided what military procedure the Navy Seals were to follow. Then gave the green light for the helicopters to leave Afghanistan to accomplish there military objective. Knowing that Failure could be political suicide...

  The conservatives continually  Talk the Talk..Preach themselves to be the party that's strong on Defense. Justifying Massive spending because their fighting the War on Terror. They also have Sarah Palin speaking : Lock and Load and insists that she is a true Patriot. When Barrack Obama did what GOP leaders were afraid to pursue. They had to claim it was because they originally extracted the nickname of a al Queda courier by torturing a terrorist detainee and Bush should get some the Credit. Then Dick's delusional  statements , that the intelligence collecting structure put in place by them, produced a treasure trove of valuable information.' Just  check the CIA archives.  So they should get as much as all the Credit. All talk...No Truth.   


     Walk the Walk... When the infamous terrorist was surrounded in Tora Bora.. No Walk.    When every source of information, known by the GOP White House,  that was coming out placing Osama  in Afghanistan or Pakistan. We had ' A Walk ' But to the wrong place which was of course, Iraq..

We still have people that don't believe the President was born into citizenship of this country. Even if he wasn't, we now know one thing for sure...  Because he had the "Gonads " to go after the man who posed  the most dangerous threats to our National Security. He has proven, not by his words but by his actions that he is a genuine Patriot of the United States of America.... and After 8 Years of incompetence. We all should Thank God, that we are finally blessed with a honest, smart and very capable Commander in Chief.....

 

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  • Public Discussion (22)
onefan51

I know that it's not true, at least I hope it's not true. But when the economy crashed in September 2008, my first thought was that the administration led by "W" and his friends were robbing the national treasure on the way out. If Cheney, Rove, Palin, and Rumsfeld want to give "W" a little credit for Osama bin Laden's demise, I'm all for it. But only if they are also willing to give "W" full credit for the severe damage that has been done to America's economy.

  • 2 votes
Reply#1 - Sat May 14, 2011 7:39 PM EDT
Silvaria

I've learned a few simple facts from my very intelligent, ultra-conservative father...

When things go well and a Democrat is in charge, it's because of the policies of the Republican before him.

When things go badly and a Democrat is in charge, it's because the Democrat is an idiot.

When things go well and a Republican is in charge, it's because the Republican did everything right.

When things go badly and a Republican is in charge, it's because of the policies of the idiot Democrat before him.

I wish like crazy that I could say I was joking...

  • 9 votes
Reply#2 - Sat May 14, 2011 7:49 PM EDT
Z1P2

Sounds about right for a partisan... and if you reverse the roles it works for ulta-leftists as well.

    #2.1 - Sat May 14, 2011 8:44 PM EDT
    amabreeze

    to: Silvaria; ' right ' it was because of Ron Reagan that Bill Clinton had the greatest economy in US history. Originally, the Obama policies were blamed for the Great recession even though it already existed. Now Bush should Credit for getting bin Laden, but he stopped looking. And so on. This is Absolutely what the article is trying to bring out, Rhetorical Garbage. Just saying something is true with No evidence that is. I'm sure your father was decent man and your not crazy. Your just very simple minded..

    • 1 vote
    #2.2 - Sat May 14, 2011 9:05 PM EDT
    Jim Dent

    Your just very simple minded..

    I think that was a bit unfair, considering Silvaria was actually supporting the premise of your argument.

    • 3 votes
    #2.3 - Sun May 15, 2011 12:45 AM EDT
    Reply
    Roy Batty

    Bush was invited to join Obama giving a celebratory speech at ground zero. He declined to share in the celebration.

    The invitation itself indicates that he deserved to be part of the event, and certainly implies his part in the overall effort.

    You can't be personally thanked if you don't show up. The insult of declining the invitation does not help either.

    • 3 votes
    Reply#3 - Sat May 14, 2011 7:59 PM EDT
    mstanley2265

    The major thing I give Bush credit for is that the retaliation against the Taliban and Bin Laden was cooly thought out. They could have nuked them.

    From the Boston Herald: DALLAS — Former President George W. Bush decided not to join President Barack Obama at a ceremony today at ground zero because he feels that acting presidents alone should preside over such official ceremonies, the former first lady said.

    Not exactly an insult, wonder how his health is?

      Reply#4 - Sat May 14, 2011 8:55 PM EDT
      folkstone

      Bush gave up looking for Bin laden 6 months after 911 and he said so.

      Obama promised that he would kill Bin laden if elected and given the chance.

      Obama got Osama and now he is dead.

      Who could be given credit?

      • 4 votes
      Reply#5 - Sat May 14, 2011 9:16 PM EDT
      SpoxLogic

      If any credit is to be given to Pres Bush is that he did pick some good people - the same people Pres Obama decided to keep on. One way to identify a good leader is if he/she knows how to choose highly capable people and then listen to what those people have to say.

        Reply#6 - Sat May 14, 2011 11:49 PM EDT
        Free Mason-1490678Deleted
        Ripley8

        Bush ? credit ?? lmao !!! hell no !! If Obama did what Bush did ??

        bin Laden would still be in Pakistan as he was during The Bushco era of destruction since Bushco didn't believe in invading Pakistan because it was a sovereign nation.......... wait... so was Iraq !!.

        Wednesday, March 07, 2007
        Bush Administration To Senate: We Can't Just Invade Some Other Country
        http://bobgeiger.blogspot.com/2007/03/bush-administration-to-senate-we-cant.html

        remember ! Bushco pulled out the marines when they were in the Tora Bora mnts. early on and actually could have gotten bin Laden then !!

        • 2 votes
        Reply#8 - Sun May 15, 2011 7:55 AM EDT
        gmross

        Ripley; don't forget that Bush was offered Bin Laden on a silver plater by the Taliban in the first six months of Afghanistan, but Bush turned them down.

        • 1 vote
        #8.1 - Sun May 15, 2011 4:45 PM EDT
        Reply
        krconnally

        I don't believe for a minute that GW quit looking for bil Laden. He may have said so in public. But we all know now that the hunt never ended. And would have come to the same conclusion no matter who was president. Pres. Obama is the president now, and enjoys the fruits of the endeavor, and rightfully so.

        Silvaria you are entirely correct. Don't want to use the word 'right' in a political blog, might wave the wrong flags. But mr wordflow amabreeze just disqualified himself as a legitimate debater, when he is unable to debate honestly.

        MR. WordFlow amabreeze. I suggest you consider the opinions of others with the integrity they hold for yours and do not disenfranchise it.

          Reply#9 - Sun May 15, 2011 8:02 AM EDT
          Ripley8

          of course he gave up... the minute he illegally invaded Iraq , a sovereign nation and refused to invade Pakistan ( whom he help arm with nuclear weapons ! ) because it was a sovereign nation. !

          he actually didn't give a crap about terrorism pre 911.

          the Bush-Cheney anti-terrorism record before September 11, 2001:

          -- Backed off Clinton administration's anti-terrorism efforts.
          -- Shelved the Hart-Rudman report.
          -- Appointed new anti-terrorism task force under Dick Cheney. Group did not even meet before 9/11.
          -- Called for cuts in anti-terrorism efforts by the Department of Defense.
          -- Gave no priority to anti-terrorism efforts by Justice Department. -- Ignored warnings from Sandy Berger, Louis Freeh, George Tennant, Paul Bremer, and Richard Clarke about the urgency of terrorist threats. -- Halted Predator drone tracking of Osama bin Laden.
          -- Did nothing in wake of August 6 C.I.A. report to president saying Al Qaeda attack by hijack of an airliner almost certain. -- Bush - knowing about the terrorists' plans to attack in America, warned that terrorists were in flight schools in the US - took a four week vacation.

          Contrasted with Clinton's real results:

          -- Sent legislation to Congress to TIGHTEN AIRPORT SECURITY. (Remember, this is before 911) The Republicans because of opposition from the airlines, defeated the legislation.
          -- Sent legislation to Congress to allow for BETTER TRACKING OF TERRORIST FUNDING. Republicans in the Senate because of opposition from banking interests, defeated it.
          -- Sent legislation to Congress to add tagents to explosives, to allow for BETTER TRACKING OF EXPLOSIVES USED BY TERRORISTS. The Republicans because of opposition from the NRA, defeated it.

          When Republicans couldn't prevent executive action, President Clinton:
          -- Developed the nation's first anti-terrorism policy, and appointed first national coordinator.
          -- Stopped cold the planned attack to blow up 12 U.S. jetliners simultaneously.
          -- Stopped cold the planned attack to blow up UN Headquarters.
          -- Stopped cold the planned attack to blow up FBI Headquarters.
          -- Stopped cold the planned attack to blow up the Israeli Embassy in Washington.
          --Stopped cold the planned attack to blow up Boston airport. -- Stopped cold the planned attack to blow up Lincoln and Holland Tunnels in NY.
          -- Stopped cold the planned attack to blow up the George Washington Bridge.
          -- Stopped cold the planned attack to blow up the US Embassy in Albania.
          -- Tried to kill Osama bin Laden and disrupt Al Qaeda through preemptive strikes (efforts denounced by the G.O.P.).
          -- Brought perpetrators of first World Trade Center bombing and CIA killings to justice.
          -- Did not blame Bush I administration for first World Trade Center bombing even though it occurred 38 days after they had left office. Instead, worked hard, even obsessively -- and successfully -- to stop future terrorist attacks.
          -- Named the Hart-Rudman commission to report on nature of terrorist threats and major steps to be taken to combat terrorism.
          -- Tripled the budget of the FBI for counterterrorism and doubled overall funding for counterterrorism.
          -- Detected and destroyed cells of Al Qaeda in over 20 countries -- Created a national stockpile of drugs and vaccines including 40 million doses of smallpox vaccine.
          -- Robert Oakley, Reagan Counterterrorism Czar says of Clinton's efforts "Overall, I give them very high marks" and "The only major criticism I have is the obsession with Osama"
          -- Paul Bremer, Bush's Administrator of Iraq disagrees slightly with Robert Oakley saying he believed the Clinton Administration had "correctly focused on bin Laden. "
          -- Barton Gellman of the Washington Post put it best, "By any measure available, Clinton left office having given greater priority to terrorism than any president before him" and was the "first administration to undertake a systematic anti-terrorist effort."

          Clinton maintained submarines armed with cruise missiles in striking distance of his camps. They could launch in, I believe, an hour of receiving intelligence of bin Laden's whereabouts. Three times, the White House received intelligence of bin Laden's presence, and that he was likely to remain at the location for at least an hour. Clinton wanted to order strikes each time, but each time, George Tenet strongly advised against them on security grounds. They didn't happen.

          One of Bush's first orders on taking office in January 2001 was to remove the submarines.

          "Clinton's advisors met nearly weekly on how to stop bin Laden...I didn't detect that kind of focus from the Bush adminsitration."
          - Two Star General Donald Kerrick

          what Republicans said about Clinton and his use of the military

          "You can support the troops but not the president" ---Rep. Tom Delay
          (R-TX)

          sound familiar ?

          " President . . . is once again releasing American military
          might on a foreign country with an ill-defined objective and no exit
          strategy. He has yet to tell the Congress how much this operation
          will cost. And he has not informed our nation's armed forces about
          how long they will be away from home. These strikes do not make for a
          sound foreign policy." ---Sen. Rick Santorum (R-PA)

          "I had doubts about the bombing campaign from the beginning . . . I
          didn't think we had done enough in the diplomatic area." ---Senator
          Trent Lott (R-MS)

          "Well, I just think it's a bad idea. What's going to happen is
          they're going to be over there for 10, 15, maybe 20 years." ---Joe
          Scarborough (R-FL)

          "Explain to the mothers and fathers of American servicemen that may
          come home in body bags why their son or daughter have to give up
          their life?" ---Sean Hannity, Fox News, 4/6/99

          "I cannot support a failed foreign policy. History teaches us that it
          is often easier to make war than peace. This administration is just
          learning that lesson right now. The President began this mission with
          very vague
          objectives and lots of unanswered questions. A month later, these
          questions are still unanswered. There are no clarified rules of
          engagement. There is no timetable. There is no legitimate definition
          of victory. There is no contingency plan for mission creep. There is
          no clear funding program. There is no agenda to bolster our over-
          extended military. There is no explanation defining what vital
          national interests are at stake. There was no strategic plan for war
          when the President started this thing, and there still is no plan
          today" ....-Rep. Tom Delay (R-TX)

          "If we are going to commit American troops, we must be certain they
          have a clear mission, an achievable goal and an exit strategy." ---
          Karen Hughes, speaking on behalf of George W. Bush

          and from the grand hypocritical liar himself !!!!

          "Victory means exit strategy, and it's important for the President to
          explain to us what the exit strategy is."
          -Governor George W. Bush (R-TX)

          His view on Clinton !

          BUSH OPPOSES NATION BUILDING...

          "If we don't stop extending our troops all around the world in nation-building missions, then we're going to have a serious problem coming down the road." [Gov. George W. Bush, 10/3/00]

          Yet what does he do ??

          ...BUSH SUPPORTS NATION BUILDING

          "We will be changing the regime of Iraq, for the good of the Iraqi people." [President Bush, 3/6/03]

          • 2 votes
          #9.1 - Sun May 15, 2011 8:26 AM EDT
          krconnally

          His focus was supposed to have been on education, economy domestic issues. His focus was taken off of that with the 9/11 attacks.

          Yes, all the things you say are true, as we aren't in full knowledge of the context of those decisions. I am not G.W.s biggest fan, but I do respect his integrity. Mr Cheney though, is different story. Although I didn't want to believe it when he was our VP, all to much evidence is coming out now that may be able to connect him to some entirely dishonest activity, which certainly needs to be discovered. But not with a slanted investigation, but a by someone, or group without anything to gain. And then they need to be investigated with constant oversight as to the purpose of their decisions. Mainly, saying I do not trust nary a one of them. Left or Right or middle. Nor do I trust a view so entirely slanted left or right, for it lacks opposition which keeps a view upright.

          Thank you for your time

          Richard

            #9.2 - Sun May 15, 2011 9:11 AM EDT
            Ripley8

            I am not G.W.s biggest fan, but I do respect his integrity.

            Integrity ?? lmao....

            ThaKATT: President Bush is a class act not like Obama that keeps slaming President Bush.

            lmao Bush a class act ? really ??

            "If we are going to commit American troops, we must be certain they have a clear mission, an achievable goal and an exit strategy." --- Karen Hughes, speaking on behalf of George W. Bush

            and from the grand hypocritical liar himself !!!!

            "Victory means exit strategy, and it's important for the President to explain to us what the exit strategy is." -Governor George W. Bush (R-TX)

            His view on Clinton !

            BUSH OPPOSES NATION BUILDING...

            "If we don't stop extending our troops all around the world in nation-building missions, then we're going to have a serious problem coming down the road." [Gov. George W. Bush, 10/3/00] ( a slam of Clinton )

            Yet what does he do ??

            ...BUSH SUPPORTS NATION BUILDING

            "We will be changing the regime of Iraq, for the good of the Iraqi people." [President Bush, 3/6/03]

            Bush blames Clinton administration for economic slowdown

            Bush blames crisis on events from ten years ago

            As he leaves office, Bush said he felt responsible for the economic downturn because it's occurring on his watch, but he added: "I think when the history of this period is written, people will realize a lot of the decisions that were made on Wall Street took place over a decade or so" before he became president.

            http://www.americablog.com/2008/12/bush-blames-crisis-on-events-from-ten.html

            ps ... deregulation ? in 99 because of republican Phil Gramm in a con congrss... who again worked it in 2002 in a con congress under bush !

            http://www.accessmylibrary.com/coms2/summary_0286-5867362_ITM

              #9.3 - Sun May 15, 2011 10:56 AM EDT
              Reply
              Rich Thomas-2189682

              Bill Clinton in the 90's had him on the crosshairs and didn't pull the trigger. If he did no 9/11 and 2 wars.

              • 1 vote
              Reply#10 - Sun May 15, 2011 8:36 AM EDT
              Ripley8

              really ??? again you can thank cons for that !!! that con congress who chanted no ! and you can thank cons and Reagan for making Bin Laden !!

              try reading #9.1 .... slowly so you'll understand.

              "Clinton's advisers met nearly weekly on how to stop bin Laden...I didn't detect that kind of focus from the Bush administration."
              - Two Star General Donald Kerrick

              - Tried to kill Osama bin Laden and disrupt Al Qaeda through preemptive strikes (efforts denounced by the G.O.P.).

              • 2 votes
              #10.1 - Sun May 15, 2011 10:59 AM EDT
              krconnally

              Ripley8 It is obvious from your entries and your blogs that your are an individual who comes to a discussion informed and prepared. This is what we need more of and thank you for that. Which makes it as important for the rest of us do as well. Your passion for discussion is equally apparent.

              Thank you

              Richard

              • 1 vote
              #10.2 - Sun May 15, 2011 12:01 PM EDT
              Reply
              Rich Thomas-2189682

              Also I honestly wish we didn't kill Saddam Hussein. None of these revolts would have happened because he would have dropped the hammer on them all especially IRAN.

              • 1 vote
              Reply#11 - Sun May 15, 2011 8:37 AM EDT
              Oliver Closoff

              NO way in @!$%#ing hell. Anybody But Obummer.

                Reply#12 - Sun May 15, 2011 10:57 AM EDT
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